The Nirmukta Freethought Community

Bala and others,

We should do a video/any other kind of artwork featuring Javed Akhtar. You guys may be busy now so I am dumping all the relevant links (videos and articles) as a kind of an archive to use later.

1. Recent nterview: JA talks about the death threats and his view regarding the fatwas issued against women working in public offices.

http://www.moneycontrol.com/video/entert...59549.html

2. NDTV news bit: speaks against Fatwa

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jieu1wyIMxo

3. His stand WRT the MF Hussain controversy. Very Interesting interview video (embedded on the page), transcript also attached.

http://ibnlive.in.com/news/devils-advoca...ingle.html

4. His now new website: 3 columns (Ayodhya, POTA and his rebuttal against SSS Ravishankar) and 1 TOI interview -- http://javedakhtar.com/inner/interview.html

5. His Poem after the Mumbai Terror attacks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLZX6LAjlNY

Thanks for this murthy. This is good stuff though I'm not sure what kind of video you have in mind.

This is a great idea. Akhtar's ideas and sentiments would indeed make a powerful video, but I am apprehensive about one thing. Before we do a video with Akhtar, since this will be the first one with an Indian atheist, I think we should go with someone that will not immediately invite the anti-Hindu criticism. This is purely a political statement. I am well aware that it means nothing objectively, but most Indians who are atheists still ally themselves with the Hindus. It is important that Nirmukta not alienate this large group of Indian atheists, but rather try to court them and show them that it is in the interests of India that we lose such religious labels altogether. Perhaps we can first put together something on Amartya Sen (he has given a lot of talks on the concept of justice, which can be mixed in with statements he has made about his atheism) and others who will not be perceived of as coming from the other side to attack Hinduism.

Ajita,

Akhtar's fierce rebuttal to the fatwa against working women is not anti-Hindu, it's anti-Muslim. His best by far, is the one he spoke at the India Today Conclave, after ravishankar. But if 'spirituality' is something we do not want to take up right now, for political reasons, I think Akhtar's responses to fatwas can be typographed for starters.

Bala, I guess it is like your reason in motion videos. Akhtar's speech at the ITC has some fantastic & succinct bits, that will come out well if typographed.

(30-05-2010 12:45 AM)egotwist Wrote:  Akhtar's fierce rebuttal to the fatwa against working women is not anti-Hindu, it's anti-Muslim.

Rakshi, there is no objective truth to the idea that Akhtar is anti-Hindu, as I clearly stated above. My point was about the skewed perspectives of many of those who identify as Hindus, who are our largest audience and the most vocal opponents of Nirmukta. I realize that Murthy was suggesting using the anti-fatwa statements, but there is the criticism of Ravishankar as well. But the most relevant fact here is Akhtar being Akhtar.

Quote:But if 'spirituality' is something we do not want to take up right now, for political reasons, I think Akhtar's responses to fatwas can be typographed for starters.

The political statement that I was making is not that Akhtar is going after spirituality or any such thing. Nobody is refuting Akhtar's brilliance and his effectiveness when used to target people who think objectively. The problem is that few people think objectively. This is why political considerations are important. The political statement is that Akhtar has a Muslim name. As irrelevant as that is from an objective perspective, politics is seldom about the truth. I know what the reactions will be, because I know how many comments from 'Hindu-Atheists' I have to delete everyday.

I do not make these political judgments in vacuum. We have released two videos by Bala so far, one by Dawkins and another by Carlin. The purpose of those videos was to bring publicity, and it is working, but if we make it two ex-Christian (Im using the term loosely) foreigners and one ex-Muslim Indian, we will be dismissed/criticized by most 'Hindu-Atheists' who comprise the biggest group of people we should be courting.

Again, I definitely think that a video starring Akhtar would be awesome. But let's have an ex-Hindu Indian first, for political reasons. That is my point here. I am not saying this is not a good idea, just that good politics can sometimes relegate good ideas to a certain time and place.

Ajita,

Point noted. I appreciate your reasoning. I have also seen many of Amartya Sen's Videos. I will dump in the relevant links for Amartya Sen ASAP on a parallel thread.

Murthy

(30-05-2010 11:46 AM)murthymail Wrote:  Ajita,

Point noted. I appreciate your reasoning. I have also seen many of Amartya Sen's Videos. I will dump in the relevant links for Amartya Sen ASAP on a parallel thread.

Murthy

Murthy, that would be awesome. In fact, I am very glad that you started this project. We could indeed create parallel threads with links to video and audio recordings of famous Indian atheists. These will surely come in handy.

Any headway with more stuff about Javed Akhtar ?

Adding some recent items...

Javed Akhtar on the perils of selective liberalism ( CNN IBN link )

A Nirmukta post in support of Javed Akhtar's 2005 speech critiquing the spirituality industry (Link)

I think while someone may express more anti-Hindu views than anti-Muslim ones, it may purely be for reasons of expedience. There are two main reasons (along the lines of Nirmukta articles on this issue) for this:

1. By criticizing Islam, one may possibly invite harm, due to the inherent violence in its structure.
2. Hinduism is more subtly malicious than Islam, and one really needs more words to express this fact. It takes more effort to debunk Deepak Chopra's and Ravishankar's pseudo-scientific/irrational claims as they are cunningly cloaked in language that seem vaguely rational. The basic tenets of Islam obviously contradict humanistic values.

But from a PR perspective, Ajita makes a great point that people will readily point out Javed Akhtar's religion. Religious people and fence-sitters specialize in ad hominem arguments given the logical flaws in their other arguments.